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PICList Thread
'Graphic LCD display'
1997\12\11@221538 by Sean Breheny

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I'm sorry if this thread has come up before, but does anyone know of a
cheap source for small graphic LCD displays (around 240x128 pixels or so)
for experimentation/prototyping. It doesn't matter if the source can
provide large numbers, or provide units in the future, I just need one or
two for prototyping purposes.

Thanks,

Sean


+--------------------------------+
| Sean Breheny                   |
| Amateur Radio Callsign: KA3YXM |
| Electrical Engineering Student |
+--------------------------------+
http://www.people.cornell.edu/pages/shb7
spam_OUTshb7TakeThisOuTspamcornell.edu
Phone(USA): (607) 253-0315

1997\12\11@222122 by Andrew Mayo

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Oatley Electronics in Sydney Australia advertises them - also I recall
seeing them advertised through a second hand vendor in the US - try an
AltaVista search.

{Quote hidden}

1997\12\12@003245 by Michael S. Hagberg

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check Timeline 800-872-8878 or 310-784-5488

they list 240x128 (backlit) Optrex $20 ea


-----Original Message-----
From: Sean Breheny <EraseMEshb7spam_OUTspamTakeThisOuTCORNELL.EDU>
To: PICLISTspamspam_OUTMITVMA.MIT.EDU <@spam@PICLISTKILLspamspamMITVMA.MIT.EDU>
Date: Thursday, December 11, 1997 9:17 PM
Subject: Graphic LCD display


{Quote hidden}

1997\12\12@021550 by William Chops Westfield

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Does anyone know specifically where to get the teeny tiny moderate resolution
LCD displays used in palmtops and/or graphing calculators?  You'd think there
would be a whole mess of these on the surplus market, but I haven't seen any.

BillW

1997\12\12@034831 by Eric Smith

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William Chops Westfield <RemoveMEbillwTakeThisOuTspamCISCO.COM> writes:
> Does anyone know specifically where to get the teeny tiny moderate resolution
> LCD displays used in palmtops and/or graphing calculators?  You'd think there
> would be a whole mess of these on the surplus market, but I haven't seen any.

Assuming that you want to buy them in small quantities, I've found that they
are readily available in office supply stores.  And you get a bunch of other
free stuff with them as well.  :-)

Seriously, though, I've never seen these displays as surplus, which I suspect
is because most non-calculator products that use dot-matrix LCDs need larger
ones.

I'd like to find a good (inexpensive) source for displays similar to the
6.1" 640x480 active matrix color LCD in the Toshiba Libretto.  I think it
is made by Sharp, but it apparently is not a standard product.

I got lucky, my Japanese Libretto 50CT has absolutely no bad pixels (either
stuck on or stuck off).  I use it as my portable PIC development system, along
with a PICSTART Plus, Clearview Mathias, Xeltek SuperPro III/L, and HP
LogicDart.  It all fits in my briefcase!

I can't wait to add an SX/Key to my development system.  If Parallax manages
to get it to me in time, it will be my best Christmas present.  (I need to
get a life.)

Cheers,
Eric

1997\12\12@084718 by Jeff Cesnik

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Try Marlin P. Jones (http://www.mpja.com/).  I just bought a few 128x64
graphic lcd's from them (~$24.00).  They're not on their website yet,
only in the catalog.

 While we're on this subject, does anyone know where I can find a
complete datasheet (and possibly a hook-up example) for a Solomon
LM7310SGL 128x64 graphic LCD?  It doesn't have a controller on board,
only row and column drivers (HD61202, HD61203).  Also, MPJA had it
listed as LED backlit, but I think it's EL.  If so, what inverter do I
need to use with this unit?

- Jeff Cesnik


Sean Breheny wrote:

{Quote hidden}

1997\12\12@092019 by John Payson

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> Seriously, though, I've never seen these displays as surplus, which I suspect
> is because most non-calculator products that use dot-matrix LCDs need larger
> ones.

The other reasons you tend never to see those dot matrix displays as used
in organizers and such as surplus:

[1] The displays are often custom-made for the organizers in question; while
   some people might have use for displays with the special annunciators and
   other features (e.g. the 4-line sharps add some special dots to allow for
   a 5 2/7-line calendar) there's no general demand for them.  In addition,
   the companies building the organizers probably only have made the number
   of displays they'll actually need.

   By contrast, companies which use more "traditional" displays may purchase
   more than they need for a particular product if it reduces their per-unit
   cost, especially if they expect to use those displays in future products.
   If a company is making 75,000 widgets the per-unit savings at the 100,000
   piece price point might justify purchasing 100,000 displays; the company
   could then resell the 25,000 extras as surplus.

[2] Most pocket organizers have the display drivers built into the main CPU
   chip; even if the larger displays need additional driver chips, some of
   the driver pins (not just the video generation logic) are on board the
   MCU.  Consequently, there's no "saleable unit" whith drivers on-board,
   so a user would have nothing but the bare glass to work with.  While it's
   not too hard driving small LCD's, the amount of work required to drive
   a 240x64 display is substantial; there's no way to justify putting that
   much work into surplus "bare glass" displays when surplus displays with
   drivers only cost $20-$40 or so.  Since almost nobody in the surplus buy-
   ing market would be able to use "bare glass" organizer displays, there's
   little point in surplus vendors' stocking them.

1997\12\12@171543 by Eric Smith

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Jeff Cesnik <TakeThisOuTjcesnikEraseMEspamspam_OUTCLARAVISTA.COM> wrote:
>   While we're on this subject, does anyone know where I can find a
> complete datasheet (and possibly a hook-up example) for a Solomon
> LM7310SGL 128x64 graphic LCD?  It doesn't have a controller on board,

Sounds like a Hitachi part number to me.

> only row and column drivers (HD61202, HD61203).  Also, MPJA had it

You can probably figure out how to control it from the data sheets on the
chips.  They should be in the Hitach LCD databook, but I don't have a copy
handy.  You could try their web site (as long as you don't mind having
Javascript enabled).

They may need to be scanned to fast for practical use with a PIC.

Cheers,
Eric

1997\12\12@190633 by William Chops Westfield

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   [palmtop, organizer, and graphing calculator LCD displays.]

   [1] The displays are often custom-made for the organizers in question;

   [2] Most pocket organizers have the display drivers built into the main
    CPU chip; even if the larger displays need additional driver chips, some
    of the driver pins (not just the video generation logic) are on board
    the MCU.  Consequently, there's no "saleable unit" whith drivers
    on-board, so a user would have nothing but the bare glass to work with.

I don't buy it.  I've seen equally custom and useless items for sale.
(Heck, I've bought some.  Anyone know something useful I can do with those
0.7inch AM Color LCD TV screens that hit six months ago?)  For that matter,
there's no end of "odd and probably unuseful" VGA resolution laptop
displays out there with little documentation...

BillW

1997\12\12@194704 by John Payson

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>     [palmtop, organizer, and graphing calculator LCD displays.]
>
>     [1] The displays are often custom-made for the organizers in question;
>
>     [2] Most pocket organizers have the display drivers built into the main
>      CPU chip; even if the larger displays need additional driver chips, some
>      of the driver pins (not just the video generation logic) are on board
>      the MCU.  Consequently, there's no "saleable unit" whith drivers
>      on-board, so a user would have nothing but the bare glass to work with.
>
> I don't buy it.  I've seen equally custom and useless items for sale.
> (Heck, I've bought some.  Anyone know something useful I can do with those
> 0.7inch AM Color LCD TV screens that hit six months ago?)  For that matter,
> there's no end of "odd and probably unuseful" VGA resolution laptop
> displays out there with little documentation...

The "odd but probably useful" VGA laptop displays can, in many cases, be
put to use with a little bit of research.  After all, there aren't all that
many companies making driver chips and it's often not too hard to figure
out what's going on.  It's often not worth it (vs buying a better-documented
display) but certainly possible.  On the other hand, you're talking about a
device that's $100's new selling surplus for $20 or so.

The organizer bare glass, on the other hand, is probably expensive enough
that the organizer manufacturers aren't going to order up many more than
they need for their production run; since organizers aren't exactly a "hit"
item, there isn't any real need to advance-order subcomponents.

The only common cases where I've seen consumer-product subassemblies for
surplus sale are those where a product's sales don't live up to anticipated
demand and so production of partially-produced units gets abandoned midstream.
After all, even if you've spent $30 building parts and subassemblies for a
unit whose finished cost is $50, it doesn't make sense to spend the other $20
if nobody wants to buy the unit anyway.  Better to salvage what you can out
of that $30.

Further, while the organizer glass is expensive enough that it's not going
to be ordered in excess quantities, it's probably not worth enough for sur-
plus cases to carry it.  Realistically speaking, who would want to spend
more than a couple bucks for such a thing, recognizing the amount of effort
required to get it working?  Even getting driver chips in onesy-twoosies
will be hard and piece price for drivers alone may exceed the price of a
display with drivers built in.

Personally, I think it would be neat if it were easier to get segment-style
displays with custom multiplex arrangements.  Unfortunately, from what I
understand that's only possible if you're getting boatloads; for anything
that standard segment/mux arrangements won't accommodate you pretty much
have to go with an alphanumeric display.

On a somewhat-related note, I find it surprising that nearly all of the
LCD displays you can get have drivers featuring lots of useless (to most
applications) Japanese characters.  It would seem there would be many
more useful things to put in those characters (some possibilities: small
caps; bold-face uppercase letters and numerals; dot-cluster characters;
etc.)  Anyone know of any other character sets?

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